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verify forged Document

Forum|Forum|2 years ago
March 14, 2024
7 replies
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I was signed up to a loan contract I never actually signed. The finance company are refusing to give me certain docs pertaining to the loan. On the loan agreement they did send, it is docusigned. It has an envelope ID, but should there be an IP address to track location or how can I prove it is a forged doc?

Best answer by Michael.Rave

@Houseoframos12

You should ask the finance company for the certificate of completion for the transaction, which will detail how and when it was signed alongside with additional details. If you signed it from your DocuSign account a copy of the document would be saved in it. Without a DocuSign account you should have received email notifications, unless it was signed with embedded signing, e.g. through an app of the finance company or in-person signing.

You can validate the actual document in any PDF reader, e.g. Adobe Acrobat Reader to verify that this actually as a DocuSign transaction and it has not been tampered with by checking the platform seal.

Michael.Rave

Answer

Docusign Employee

@Houseoframos12

You should ask the finance company for the certificate of completion for the transaction, which will detail how and when it was signed alongside with additional details. If you signed it from your DocuSign account a copy of the document would be saved in it. Without a DocuSign account you should have received email notifications, unless it was signed with embedded signing, e.g. through an app of the finance company or in-person signing.

You can validate the actual document in any PDF reader, e.g. Adobe Acrobat Reader to verify that this actually as a DocuSign transaction and it has not been tampered with by checking the platform seal.

"Select as Best" below if you find my answer is a valid solution to your issue and mark it as resolved.

H

Houseoframos12

Author

Newcomer

Thank you for your response. I never had a DocuSign account before a few days ago. I didn't receive any email notifications. Unfortunately the finance company are refusing to hand over anything. They won't respond to complaints to bbb,cfpb, or state Attorney Generals. This was a massive ponzi scheme operation, which has left thousands of people fighting it by themselves. I am not the only one who's signature was forged, so I'm just trying to find out how to prove that.

A

Alejandro.Ramos

Docusign Employee

Hi @Houseoframos12,

I hope you are doing well.

I would like to confirm if you were able to solve your issue by utilizing the solution that was suggested?

If so, please mark it as the best answer by clicking “Select as Best” to make it easier for other users to find

Otherwise, feel free to let me know and I will gladly help you address the situation as soon as possible.

Best regards,

Alejandro R. | DocuSign Community Moderator

"Select as Best" below if you find the answer a valid solution to your issue!

H

ho2004

New Voice

@Houseoframos12

You should ask the finance company for the certificate of completion for the transaction, which will detail how and when it was signed alongside with additional details. If you signed it from your DocuSign account a copy of the document would be saved in it. Without a DocuSign account you should have received email notifications, unless it was signed with embedded signing, e.g. through an app of the finance company or in-person signing.

You can validate the actual document in any PDF reader, e.g. Adobe Acrobat Reader to verify that this actually as a DocuSign transaction and it has not been tampered with by checking the platform seal.

I have a similar situation where the docusign was signed by a docusign account that is not mine but was created with my name using an email I do not own. How can I prove in court that I don’t own that DocuSign account with my name on it?
Thanks.

A

Alejandro.Ramos

Docusign Employee

Hi @ho2004,

Thank you for sharing your experience.

When contesting a signature’s validity in court a simple “electronic signature” will not be considered valid in all scenarios, as this signature workflow doesn’t prove the recipient’s identity. For most high-value transactions, you will be required to use an Advanced or Qualified Electronic Signature, which includes an extra recipient verification step. For more details on this topic, see:

Types of Digital Signature: AES, QES, SES, explained

What is the difference between a Digital Signature and an Electronic Signature | Docusign

Are Electronic Signatures Safe?

Accepted Trust Service Providers: Europe

If the signature in question was not a Digital Signature, its validity can be easily contested in court.

Please don't hesitate to let me know if you have any other questions or concerns and I will address them as soon as possible.

Best regards,

Alejandro R. | Docusign Community Moderator

Please click "Best Answer" below if you find my reply to be a valid solution to your issue!

H

ho2004

New Voice

Hi @ho2004,

Thank you for sharing your experience.

When contesting a signature’s validity in court a simple “electronic signature” will not be considered valid, as this signature workflow doesn’t prove the recipient’s identity. For most high-value transactions, you will be required to use an Advanced or Qualified Electronic Signature, which includes an extra recipient verification step. For more details on this topic, see:

Types of Digital Signature: AES, QES, SES, explained

What is the difference between a Digital Signature and an Electronic Signature | Docusign

Are Electronic Signatures Safe?

Accepted Trust Service Providers: Europe

If the signature in question was not a Digital Signature, its validity can be easily contested in court.

Please don't hesitate to let me know if you have any other questions or concerns and I will address them as soon as possible.

Best regards,

Alejandro R. | Docusign Community Moderator

Please click "Best Answer" below if you find my reply to be a valid solution to your issue!

Thanks. Finally, some good answers in this thread.
Here are some legal precedences:
1)

https://digt.com/electronicsignature/tpost/z4zb23dcb1-electronic-signature-fraud-a-legal-case#:~:text=After%20analyzing%20the%20evidence,%20including%20DocuSign%20metadata%20and%20mobile%20phone

After analyzing the evidence, including DocuSign metadata and mobile phone location evidence, the court held that Matthew used Sarah's account to sign the agreement without her knowledge or consent since she did not sign it when he asked her to do so. Sarah was not liable to pay the remaining amount in favor of Marketlend.
========

2)

you do not need to prove anything, the burden of proof is on them as Docusign signitures are in the class "those for which signatures are reputed worthless unless a positive proof of attribution to the alleged signer is shown".

– User65535

CommentedJul 17 at 21:03

This question is similar to: How do you prove a fact at issue in litigation?. If you believe it’s different, please edit the question, make it clear how it’s different

https://law.stackexchange.com/questions/103924/how-to-prove-that-someone-forged-my-signature-on-a-contract-that-i-was-not-aware#:~:text=The%20most%20obvious%20option%20is%20to%20testify%20under%20oath%20that

testify under oath that you didn't sign it. Sworn testimony is admissible evidence, even when it comes from a party to a dispute.

A

Alejandro.Ramos

Docusign Employee

Hi @ho2004,

Thank you for sharing these resources.

I truly appreciate you taking the time of sharing the answer to this question based on historical cases, I am certain that this information will help future users facing this scenario.

Best regards,

Alejandro R. | Docusign Community Moderator

Please click "Best Answer" below if you find my reply to be a valid solution to your issue!

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